Has this photo been altered?

[Winstan]

The first photo is in question, original is second.
Third has also been altered.

To remove the freckles and possibly change the nose of the first picture.

Would be able to say it has? and is the same person in all photos ?

Thanks for the advice

 

[Impossible Face]

I really can't see enough of the other photos to be able to tell if they are all the same person. Changes to the nose may be a giveaway though.

 

[polarwoc]

I took Photo 1 and traced the facial contours, then stroked the paths to get an outline.
Then, I placed the Photo 2 beside it and duplicated this outline onto the face and aligned it by the chin.

As you can see, the facial shape does not match. Height of lips from chin does not match. Shape of lips do not match. Shape of nose and nostrils do not match.

Hence, given the limited data, I think it is probable that Photo 1 and Photo 2 are not same people.
Also, I add that the above analysis is based on the given data, and reality could be very, very different and they could have been the same person - I do not know.

 

[Winstan]

I really can't see enough of the other photos to be able to tell if they are all the same person. Changes to the nose may be a giveaway though.

What's your opinion on the freckles ?

I ran it through a website called photo forensics and , but ok not sure what I'm looking at ,
But it looks like they were there originally

 

[Winstan]

Thanks ,

I took Photo 1 and traced the facial contours, then stroked the paths to get an outline.
Then, I placed the Photo 2 beside it and duplicated this outline onto the face and aligned it by the chin.
View attachment 125524
As you can see, the facial shape does not match. Height of lips from chin does not match. Shape of lips do not match. Shape of nose and nostrils do not match.

Hence, given the limited data, I think it is probable that Photo 1 and Photo 2 are not same people.
Also, I add that the above analysis is based on the given data, and reality could be very, very different and they could have been the same person - I do not know.

Photos 1&3 look more probable would you say

ok noted thank you ,
And the smailes on photos on and to would be a more comparable match ?

Im more focused on the freckles , between photos 1 and 2 and if they have been removed , for me if they have that will be a confirmation its the same person

I have uploaded the photo to forensically website, but to be honest i find it difficult to use the website tools at hand with my limited knowledge to understand the data I'm being shown, it shows something like an original freckle does it ?


I did notice however some fair similarities between photos 1 & 2 with distances to locations where the freckles have been edited out.

Would somebody be able to have look with a website and report back their opinion , I used the website forensically.

Here are the results , from one photo tool where the locations of the original freckles seem to match up with a natural photo.
I have drawn lines to show the relative angle from the mouth and nose to the freckles.

Using the forensically website , is it possible to see where the outlined items have been altered/ removed ,?

If so would someone be so kind to have a look for me ,

thank you



Many thanks

 

[JeffK]

This is difficult to impossible to answer. Like when people post images of license plates from security cameras - the act of trying to pull data is manipulation itself. Lighting, resolution, magnification, dust and scratches, and even our own imaginations can add to the muddle. If there's something criminal behind this, I'd suggest - with great caution - to hire a forensic expert.

 

[polarwoc]

Photos 1&3 look more probable would you say

Just by sight, I would tend to agree Photos 1 and 3 are probably the same person.

And the smailes on photos on and to would be a more comparable match ?

I think between Photos 1 and 2, the lips seem similar - but most definitely Photo 2 is a different click - not an edited version of Photo 1.

...focused on the freckles , between photos 1 and 2...

It would be difficult to compare the freckles of the two mentioned pics, because Picture 2 is too grainy to make a judgement on the freckles.

I did notice however some fair similarities between photos 1 & 2 with distances to locations where the freckles have been edited out.

If you notice the outline traced superimposed image, you would notice the distance between chin and lips are totally different. Also, the shape of both nose and nostril are totally different. I think Photo 1 and 2 are different people.

Using the forensically website , is it possible to see where the outlined items have been altered/ removed ,?

If you are thinking Photo 2 is obtained after taking Photo 1 and editing it in PS, you are probably mistaken. Lets say even if freckles are removed, it would be difficult to get that sort of grain and noise on the image. Photo 2 looks like it was clicked by an older model phone camera.

 

[Winstan]

Just by sight, I would tend to agree Photos 1 and 3 are probably the same person.


I think between Photos 1 and 2, the lips seem similar - but most definitely Photo 2 is a different click - not an edited version of Photo 1.


It would be difficult to compare the freckles of the two mentioned pics, because Picture 2 is too grainy to make a judgement on the freckles.


If you notice the outline traced superimposed image, you would notice the distance between chin and lips are totally different. Also, the shape of both nose and nostril are totally different. I think Photo 1 and 2 are different people.

If you are thinking Photo 2 is obtained after taking Photo 1 and editing it in PS, you are probably mistaken. Let's say, even if freckles are removed, it would be difficult to get that sort of grain and noise on the image. Photo 2 looks like it was clicked by an older model phone camera.

It would be difficult to compare the freckles of the two mentioned pics, because Picture 2 is too grainy to make a judgement on the freckles.

... agreed one and three do look very similar , and i don't know how to use the forensically website to see if anything is off

Have you tried to run the picture through an editing software by any chance if your familiar with those ?

If you notice the outline traced superimposed image, you would notice the distance between chin and lips are totally different. Also, the shape of both nose and nostril are totally different. I think Photo 1 and 2 are different people. .... agreed but i feel that the smile on the second photo definitely doesn't match, but photos 1 and three it seems to. Including the distances and all that.

If you could try that on photos one and three please and report back the results, that would be appreciated !

 

[Winstan]

This is difficult to impossible to answer. Like when people post images of license plates from security cameras - the act of trying to pull data is manipulation itself. Lighting, resolution, magnification, dust and scratches, and even our own imaginations can add to the muddle. If there's something criminal behind this, I'd suggest - with great caution - to hire a forensic expert.

Thanks for the input ,
its not a criminal case , its for personal use.

 

[JeffK]

Thanks for the input ,
its not a criminal case , its for personal use.

Are these cropped versions of images you have on hand? If we had the originals, there would be a better shot at comparison. If you're worried about privacy, you can black out some portions of the face or even take it to the paid forum to keep it inside a private conversation...

 

[Winstan]

Unfortunately ,
The original photo number 1 is all I have to work with , although I can get more pictures , but then we would still only have the nose mouth to work with the ratio right ?

 

[Winstan]

Just by sight, I would tend to agree Photos 1 and 3 are probably the same person.


I think between Photos 1 and 2, the lips seem similar - but most definitely Photo 2 is a different click - not an edited version of Photo 1.


It would be difficult to compare the freckles of the two mentioned pics, because Picture 2 is too grainy to make a judgement on the freckles.


If you notice the outline traced superimposed image, you would notice the distance between chin and lips are totally different. Also, the shape of both nose and nostril are totally different. I think Photo 1 and 2 are different people.

If you are thinking Photo 2 is obtained after taking Photo 1 and editing it in PS, you are probably mistaken. Lets say even if freckles are removed, it would be difficult to get that sort of grain and noise on the image. Photo 2 looks like it was clicked by an older model phone camera.

Photo to was taken after wards ,
Photo 1 is actually a zoomed in version of a photo taken my the internet.

I'm trying to find out if the taker has purposely removed their distinguishing of their face to avoid being recognised.
Photo 2 hasn't been edited to become into #100%
It would have been a selfie #1

 

[JeffK]

As a mentor of mine once said, you can get so deep into the minutae that it's almost like arguing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. In other words, the actual question is obscured.

In any case, I placed the 1st image on top of the second image and tried to get them into the same position. The camera angles are slightly different and I don't want to distort using warp etc to make it fit.

Here's the basic result:



I ran the iimage thru Denoise to clean up as best as I could and then thru Gigapixel to enlarge it as best I could. If you notice, in image #2, there is a beauty mark somewhat in line with the right corner of her mouth:



If I then turn on the layer with Image #1 active and the green circle in the same position, no beauty mark:



Seems a bit of an exercise but if you take Image #1 only and look for that beauty mark:



Is it there? Or not? Remnants? You can talk yourself into it. Or are we just trying to guess how many angels dance on the head of a pin?

There really aren't any other distinguishing marks to go by. Is it Photoshopped? Could be...or not. The resolution is far too low to nail it down.