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All shades of yellow


viki2000

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I would like to have one or more A4 pages ready for print with all possible shades/nuances of yellow.
It would be nice small rectangles, each filled with one type of yellow, similar with Excel cells, but Excel does not provide so many variations of yellow.

My question is how can this be achieved in Photoshop.

The purpose is to calibrate the color scanned paper vs. color printed paper in order to match the colors.
I have noticed on internet many complicated explanations on this subject of color matching/calibration, but what I have in mind is next:
  • The original color paper scanned in PC, Photoshop.
  • Use a smartphone camera with a dedicated color recognition app to find the RGB values – as approx. values.
  • Having one or more printed pages with a big variation of yellow (I am interested only in yellow) and use the same smartphone camera, at the same distance, light to get the same RGB values.
  • Maybe it works also with a software in PC to compare the scanned original and the scanned printed paper with variations of yellow.
I avoid then all kind of needed calibrations in-between with screen, printer…
I do not know if that is smart or not or if it brings further color errors in the shades of yellow that I need to match but is the simplest thing that I can do with a non-professional LaserJet color printer.
You understand now the background why I need those A4 sheets with yellow variations or a technique how or generate them.
Any other suggestions are appreciated and welcome.
 
It would be nice small rectangles, each filled with one type of yellow, similar with Excel cells, but Excel does not provide so many variations of yellow.

I happen to be pretty good at Excel. If that was your original approach, are you aware that the Excel color picker has a Custom window which is essentially identical to Photoshop's color picker? See Excel screen-shot below.

Excel.jpg

When you say you need "all possible shades/nuances of yellow", I think that would literally be thousands of individual colors, so I'm not sure how you would actually achieve that using either Excel or Photoshop. The RGB color picker has 255 possible values of Red, Green and Blue, which mathematically comes to roughly 13 million possible colors. I'm not sure how many of those are in the yellow family, but it will surely be a massive number. The only easy way I can think of to generate a large number of yellows is to use the gradient tool, but in that case the colors will not be in neat little rectangles. I'm no expert in color calibration, but do you really need every possible yellow, or just a few dozen representative yellows?
 
If we make variations of all 256 numbers for R and G and B then we get indeed 16777216 possibilities, but wait, not all are yellow.

I juts need variations around the colour RGB (255,255,0), even if we have to modify R and G and B, but not to see other colour as green or blue or red or white or black or whatever is far away of yellow cantered in RGB (255,255,0), I mean when I look with the naked eye I want to see yellow in variations and not other colours.
 
Agree. But if there are 16 million colors in total (that's what I meant to say in my original post), then how many of them are variations of yellow? I'm not sure how to define the entire family of "yellow", but if (255,255,0) is pure yellow, then (254,255,0) will be a slightly different yellow, and (255,255,1) will be another slightly different yellow. In reality, nobody will be able to perceive the difference between these three examples, but they do exist as distinct variations of yellow. Do you agree that there are thousands of these combinations that can all be considered yellow?
 
"Do you agree that there are thousands of these combinations that can all be considered yellow?"
Agree.

What is in my mind and how to narrow the results:
- If I take a A4 (210 × 297 mm) paper and I make in Excel cells 5x5mm, then I might get (210/5) x (297/5) ~ 43x59=2537 variations of yellow. Maybe 4 of such pages with 10.000 variations of yellow is good enough for me.
- What does it mean variations? Up to what extent should we change R, G, B and to say that is still yellow?
The only “natural” way to describe it, and I have no idea now how to translate it in computers interpretation of the color as numbers RGB, is to think at the wide spectrum of the solar white light and then the use of a Newton’s prism experiment (https://www.khanacademy.org/partner...ce/mit-k12-physics/v/newtons-prism-experiment ) to separate the colors, then we get the rainbow. Let’s think at the colors in the rainbow as individual colors and not variations of the yellow, even if using RGB system could reproduce some of them.
What is the purpose of it?
- I have in my hand a yellow paper and I would like to try to print “the same” yellow color on another A4 paper. By “the same” I understood the best approximation that I can get with my non-professional LaserJet printer. I just want to come as close as possible to the original yellow paper that I have in my hand, but it does not need to be a “industrial” grade with very high precision of matching.
How do I want to do it?
- I just want to try few pages of yellow color with many small spots, rectangles and compare with the original yellow paper. If few smartphone cameras + few scanners + few naked eyes cannot make the difference, then is good enough.
- The idea is to scan the original paper and the reference paper with many variations of yellow and to compare them. The scanning is done with the same devices, under the same conditions of light, distance. I do not need to know what color code that on the screen is or in reality and I do not care as long as they match close enough.
- I do not have a better description of what I want to achieve, because I do not have better possibilities to achieve better results.
If in Excel with VBA (or Photoshop) I run 0 to 255 on color variation on each cell and then play also with (hue or saturation or luminance) around the yellow RGB (255, 255,0) then I think would be a start. But I am just wondering if it could be perhaps more possibilities.
If you tell me that yellow means the spectrum of light with wavelengths between 570 and 590nm, then I do not care, because I have no means to measure it and it does not help either to achieve my purpose.
Maybe put it in other words, to describe better “the rabbit hole”: I am trying to implement an approximation of color management for potentially non-color-managed devices using a non-calibrated tool like a smart phone camera with a non-standard light source.
I try to rely on the fact that the same scanning device gives a systematic error, as an offset if you want, even if autofocus may introduce errors, but I have no other better way to do it except to use several devices to compare the results, given the fact that smartphones, scanner and PCs are everywhere nowadays.
The method above does not tell you what yellow color code is, it just tries to “clone” the original colored yellow paper.
If I may consider the error from these scanners constant and if several devices which compare the original scanned paper and the new printed yellow scanned paper declare the same yellow (even within small variation) and then those papers are also compared by few pairs of naked eyes in solar white light, but not direct sun light, and cannot make the difference, then is good enough for me, I achieve my purpose and I am out of the “rabbit hole”.
Now, you understand why I need such A4 paper with many variations of yellow.
The Excel file with VBA code provided below is a start, but how to get more variations by playing with R and G and not only with B, in such way that we do not get into other colors detected by our eye as one from rainbow spectrum for example?
We cannot have green or red or blue or black or white and say that is a variation of yellow, because even if for the computer is, for my eyes is not.
How to limit the RGB numbers variation and to stay within yellow nuances, which seen by our eyes is still declared yellow? I realize is a problem also from person to person how color is detected, but I just speak in general referring at the fact that I do not want to R and G and B numbers to be changed in 16 millions possibilities, which represent all the colors.
Perhaps a simple approach is to start with RGB(255, 255, 0) and run 10.000 variations of yellow around this point without breaking the rainbow rule.
Any idea how to implement it?

Attached is an Excel file with small variations of yellow done in VBA.
 

Attachments

  • yellow.zip
    18.3 KB · Views: 1
I think I understand what you're trying to do, but I don't know how to do it. Sorry. Perhaps somebody else here will have some suggestions.
My original reply was only to point out that Excel has the capability of producing any RGB color, if you wanted to use Excel for this project.
 
Hi Viki2000
Here is one way provide a grid array of different variations for a fixed hue. My example is for "shades" of green as shown in the image below as an end result.

The key to this approach is to in the end use the Filter> Other > HSB/HSL filter with some trickery

I am using a grid that is 16 x 16 with the HSB model with pure Green Hue and then varying the Saturation and Brightness in orthogonal axis.

To make things easily divisible, I started with an image of 1024 pixels on a side which make each color square 16 pixels by 16 pixels.

In HSB mode, the red channel represents Hue, the green channel represents Saturation, and the Blue channel represents Brightness

The gray level for Hue that represents Green is 85 (it is 42 or 43 for Yellow). So I painted the Red channel with a gray value of 85

For the green channel (Saturation) I wanted a black to white gradient going from left to right. I just used the gradient tool for this (note, use the smoothness value set at 0)
Now use the Image > Adjustments > Posterize with the number of levels set to 16

For the Blue channel (Brightness) I wanted a black to white gradient going from bottom to top (set same as in prior step)
Also posterize the Blue channel to 16 levels as in the prior step

Now use the Filer > Other > HSB/HSL with settings going from HSB to RGB

You now have a chart with a 16 bt 16 grid with green varied by Saturation and Brightness

I created a 16x16 pixel pattern with a 2 pixel black boundary, filled an overlaying Layer with this pattern to give the final result.

Hope this gives you and idea on one way to approach this problem
John Wheeler

Shades-of-green.jpg
 
To prevent you from posting already known answers again, you should also read the Adobe forum.

 
@Rich54
Thank you for the suggestions so far and for the honest answer.

@thebestcpu
Thank you very much the proposed solution and the time taken to explain it. I will try to see what I can do yellow, but definitely is a god approach for green.

@ph_o_e_n_ix
I asked the question in different forums, including the one mentioned above.
I hope there is no restriction in asking on different forums in the world-wide-web. Isn’t it?...unless we speak about the same common group of forums leaded by the same persons, under the same virtual dome.
My experience shows that a brainstorming of ideas is always productive, and I see no harm in asking the same question on different places.
What I consider unpleasant is the copy/paste answers from different forums.
From this point of view, I am glad that you point it out.
 

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