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Tips On Beautifying This Ugly Girl?
- Thread starter Bronson
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sprucemagoo1
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LOl, I had work at 9 this morn, and now I'm going to go do some bar work, Then I'll be up all morning again!
Sleep is hard to do!
Sleep is hard to do!
Twelvebitstyle
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I like that you are trying multiple approaches. I do however think that you are asking quite a lot out of that image, theres just not a lot to work with. When working on images like this you have to stay within the restraints of the image quality. Don't try to make it look better than it can, I would focus on making it look like a bad picture of a "more attractive" girl by evening out lights and darks and increasing facial symmetry.
As far as this image looking like a magazine cover, I don't think there is anything that any one could do to bring it up to that level except for taking a new picture
In my attempt, I'm thinking less is more. did some liquifying, brightening, slight smoothing, and of course black hair... just because.
As far as this image looking like a magazine cover, I don't think there is anything that any one could do to bring it up to that level except for taking a new picture
In my attempt, I'm thinking less is more. did some liquifying, brightening, slight smoothing, and of course black hair... just because.
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Bronson
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Hey, that actually looks pretty good! You're right, it's not magazine cover material, but I see what you're saying about less being more. Thanks for the help.
sprucemagoo1 said:
...I think you are too angry of a person for this thread. Thank you for the help you have given me so far, but I don't want any more of your advice.
Paul
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Ease up mate.
mrlemonyfresh
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Hi, my name is Simon or 'mr lemony fresh' as I'm known on the net.
Wow.. where to start.
First off, you might be surprised how many 'ugly' people there are out there who see this post and feel bad about them selves, much less next the the actually girl who might one day chance upon a forum where strangers are analytically detailing every wrong feature of her face. Of course you're going to get the odd person telling you off. You need to be conscious of the thoughts and feelings of people around you, and as a designer, it will become increasingly important to keep in mind NOT to offend the potential numbers of the demographic you're trying to appeal towards.
'Ugly' women read glossy magazines too.
Now I believe I can help you towards you're goal but these people are right in a few ways, this image is unacceptable. Not because of the girl, she is not that unusual, at least not naturally. The reason THIS photo is not a good one is due to the following reasons:
The lighting is bad, the below light illuminates unflattering features, like the gullet of her neck. It also subconsiously makes you think she has facial hair upon first glance because it shades her upper lip, who knows whether her hair shadow is causing her too look as though she has a mono-brow? who knows, the photo is just all round bad quality, not sharp or crisp like a proper photographer would have it. You need the best start as a photo manipulator, and this just isn't quality enough. The other thing is the lighting may be contributing to the unhealthy looking eye shadow.
Now without knowing this you may continue trying to alter pictures such as this, fixing the face only to wonder why it looks 'cartoonish' or sticks out weirdly and that is partly because you may not have considered some of these imperfections are caused by bad lighting and have tried to fix it and found it suddenly looks weird against the background.
It also helps to have a technical knowledge of photography to know why the photo wouldn't work as well; The lens length on this camera is probably quite short and therefore like to distort the features of her face a little.
So while it is possible to make her look pretty, the camera and setup is just not suitable for publication unless it's a sneaky 'look how such a such looks now that she stopped doing such an such routine'.
Now, with that said, let's see what we can do with the beauty aspect... Theory is you're friend. for instance the 'averageness' in beauty describes the medium of someone's face compared to the masses. In other words, women like Megan fox in her prime are some of THE MOST 'average' women. heheh
search for Averageness on wikipedia, this forum won't let me post links..
I've compiled a list of reasons the girl could be considered to be 'ugly'
Features that contrast harshly, detracting from her gender identity and because they occur rarely and tend to be unpopular. These rare occurrence of such features generally cause those blessed with averaged features to see them as ugly:
-Shade between brows to suggest a facial hair anomaly (this could also be because of the bad lighting)
-Also on her eye brows, there is a slight inconsistency in some parts, eyebrows that aren't full appear scruffy and harsh which isn't characteristic of a beautiful female face.
Features of the face that suggest bad health also detract from appearance.
-Eye shadows
-skin discolouration and imperfection
-Slightly droopy eye lids (eye shadows, droopy eyes - same boat)
FACIAL PROPORTION AND SHAPE
-Unusually, her nose appears higher than the average girl, probably due to a couple of separate reasons:
-her upper lip is downward facing, it seems her pallet is shaped differently than the average girl
-The actual nose seems to be a little higher than normal
-Her nose appears less shapely and more rounded as it protrudes.
As for her hair, it's difficult to tell in this lighting, but I'd say it looks alright.
her ear pokes out a bit through her hair which is a little childish, but I won't bother to fix that.
I've made a list of all the things I think could be improved and made changes BASED on that. A wise man once said "[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Geneva,SunSans-Regular]If you fail to plan, you can plan to fail" and because of the many things we as designers need to consider at any given moment this is very crucial.
Here are my before and after shots of the girl based on my list and the theory on this page: majorityrights.com-weblog-comments-the_facial_proportions_of_beautiful_people (swap '-' for '/' )
[/FONT]
-I changed proportions using liquify
-I fixed bad tone and colour using a hard brush and sample better nearby colours
-I smoothed parts of the skin using the blur tool to get a more touchable finish.
Wow.. where to start.
First off, you might be surprised how many 'ugly' people there are out there who see this post and feel bad about them selves, much less next the the actually girl who might one day chance upon a forum where strangers are analytically detailing every wrong feature of her face. Of course you're going to get the odd person telling you off. You need to be conscious of the thoughts and feelings of people around you, and as a designer, it will become increasingly important to keep in mind NOT to offend the potential numbers of the demographic you're trying to appeal towards.
'Ugly' women read glossy magazines too.
Now I believe I can help you towards you're goal but these people are right in a few ways, this image is unacceptable. Not because of the girl, she is not that unusual, at least not naturally. The reason THIS photo is not a good one is due to the following reasons:
The lighting is bad, the below light illuminates unflattering features, like the gullet of her neck. It also subconsiously makes you think she has facial hair upon first glance because it shades her upper lip, who knows whether her hair shadow is causing her too look as though she has a mono-brow? who knows, the photo is just all round bad quality, not sharp or crisp like a proper photographer would have it. You need the best start as a photo manipulator, and this just isn't quality enough. The other thing is the lighting may be contributing to the unhealthy looking eye shadow.
Now without knowing this you may continue trying to alter pictures such as this, fixing the face only to wonder why it looks 'cartoonish' or sticks out weirdly and that is partly because you may not have considered some of these imperfections are caused by bad lighting and have tried to fix it and found it suddenly looks weird against the background.
It also helps to have a technical knowledge of photography to know why the photo wouldn't work as well; The lens length on this camera is probably quite short and therefore like to distort the features of her face a little.
So while it is possible to make her look pretty, the camera and setup is just not suitable for publication unless it's a sneaky 'look how such a such looks now that she stopped doing such an such routine'.
Now, with that said, let's see what we can do with the beauty aspect... Theory is you're friend. for instance the 'averageness' in beauty describes the medium of someone's face compared to the masses. In other words, women like Megan fox in her prime are some of THE MOST 'average' women. heheh
search for Averageness on wikipedia, this forum won't let me post links..
I've compiled a list of reasons the girl could be considered to be 'ugly'
Features that contrast harshly, detracting from her gender identity and because they occur rarely and tend to be unpopular. These rare occurrence of such features generally cause those blessed with averaged features to see them as ugly:
-Shade between brows to suggest a facial hair anomaly (this could also be because of the bad lighting)
-Also on her eye brows, there is a slight inconsistency in some parts, eyebrows that aren't full appear scruffy and harsh which isn't characteristic of a beautiful female face.
Features of the face that suggest bad health also detract from appearance.
-Eye shadows
-skin discolouration and imperfection
-Slightly droopy eye lids (eye shadows, droopy eyes - same boat)
FACIAL PROPORTION AND SHAPE
-Unusually, her nose appears higher than the average girl, probably due to a couple of separate reasons:
-her upper lip is downward facing, it seems her pallet is shaped differently than the average girl
-The actual nose seems to be a little higher than normal
-Her nose appears less shapely and more rounded as it protrudes.
As for her hair, it's difficult to tell in this lighting, but I'd say it looks alright.
her ear pokes out a bit through her hair which is a little childish, but I won't bother to fix that.
I've made a list of all the things I think could be improved and made changes BASED on that. A wise man once said "[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Geneva,SunSans-Regular]If you fail to plan, you can plan to fail" and because of the many things we as designers need to consider at any given moment this is very crucial.
Here are my before and after shots of the girl based on my list and the theory on this page: majorityrights.com-weblog-comments-the_facial_proportions_of_beautiful_people (swap '-' for '/' )
[/FONT]
-I changed proportions using liquify
-I fixed bad tone and colour using a hard brush and sample better nearby colours
-I smoothed parts of the skin using the blur tool to get a more touchable finish.
mrlemonyfresh
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Nobody thanked me for my efforts =|
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Novo
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Bronson...boy oh boy, what a thread, where to start? lol
Let's start about you using the word "ugly". It irritates a lot of people (also in this forum) who are already fed up with a world in which everything has to look perfect. On top of that, I’m pretty sure you know how looks can vary depending on time of day, physical condition, make-up, short angle lens, poor lighting or just the wrong facial expression, so for you to pass judgement on someone based on some random picture you took off the internet makes you look like a hypocrite, sorry.
You also fail to understand that there is a substantial difference between shooting a photo of that same Italian model you posted without make-up and hair job in the morning 1 hour after she woke up or being on a photo shoot. You live in La-La land.
Having a title like "Tips On Beautifying This Ugly Girl?" already sets the wrong tone for a lot of people, a title like "How can I make this girl look prettier?" sounds quite different.
Having said that, it would be nice to know what this is for. It really helps in a process like this to know what the goals are, because it's directly connected to the technical approach.
Now let me say one thing; if you want quality, then you need to start with quality. I'm going to be totally straightforward with you; this photo (not the subject) is rubbish; too small, bad image quality, bad quality from a photography perspective.
I never use this kind of source material to make something beautiful, unless I'm dealing with photos that have a serious emotional value for someone.
Nevertheless, you can make beautiful things out of bad photos, but then you're moving away from photo retouching.
You do need a wake-up call, which sprucemagoo1 was already rightfully trying to explain. The point is this: the more you fiddle with someone's face, there more it starts to look artificial. The bad results are multiplied if people like you don't have excellent skills to begin with. Another wake-up call is that Photoshop does not make you a great artist or designer. You only get good results if you're a skillful user, period.
It's also VERY important to know that these skills go way beyond Photoshop skills that most can learn. Especially in photo retouching, you need to have skills in numerous areas. You need to have good photography skills, a good understanding of composition, a good understanding of skin tones, facial features and expressions, lighting, colors, make-up, fashion, etc.
I can guarantee you that you currently have none of these skills. Yes, this may sound harsh and it's not my intention, but that just the reality and part of our wake-up call for you. One example: the eyes. The eyes are the MOST important part of a face, they are the doorway to our soul. You on the other hand have killed the eyes and consequently killed the soul. The eyes are always the main focal point in any portrait in which the subject is looking at the viewer. Mess up in that area and you’ve already ruined the complete image before you even start fixing other areas.
Face it: you don't know how to draw or paint a face, let alone paint a face that is beautiful. Photoshop will NOT improve those skills, period. You seriously need to know your limitations and the limitations of an image editor.
If you want to see what skills are required to do such intense photo retouching, then go to YouTube and search for videos of the user CGSBGS, with the titles…
Speed Painting Photo Realism: "In Memory of Richard..."
Speed Painting Photorealism... Again.
…or his other videos. Only those are the people cable of totally redesigning a face with a satisfying result. But their experience is based on years of practice and studies mixed with some talent.
The fact that you continue to overestimate your current skills, is also the reason why sprucemagoo1 was getting so frustrated with you, because you simply don't accept reality.
You need to use Bob Ross as an example; he loved what he did and wanted to share with everybody how to get the same joy out of painting. Not for a single second was he teaching people to boost his own ego, not for single moment was he waiting for a round of applause.
Let's start about you using the word "ugly". It irritates a lot of people (also in this forum) who are already fed up with a world in which everything has to look perfect. On top of that, I’m pretty sure you know how looks can vary depending on time of day, physical condition, make-up, short angle lens, poor lighting or just the wrong facial expression, so for you to pass judgement on someone based on some random picture you took off the internet makes you look like a hypocrite, sorry.
You also fail to understand that there is a substantial difference between shooting a photo of that same Italian model you posted without make-up and hair job in the morning 1 hour after she woke up or being on a photo shoot. You live in La-La land.
Having a title like "Tips On Beautifying This Ugly Girl?" already sets the wrong tone for a lot of people, a title like "How can I make this girl look prettier?" sounds quite different.
Having said that, it would be nice to know what this is for. It really helps in a process like this to know what the goals are, because it's directly connected to the technical approach.
Now let me say one thing; if you want quality, then you need to start with quality. I'm going to be totally straightforward with you; this photo (not the subject) is rubbish; too small, bad image quality, bad quality from a photography perspective.
I never use this kind of source material to make something beautiful, unless I'm dealing with photos that have a serious emotional value for someone.
Nevertheless, you can make beautiful things out of bad photos, but then you're moving away from photo retouching.
You do need a wake-up call, which sprucemagoo1 was already rightfully trying to explain. The point is this: the more you fiddle with someone's face, there more it starts to look artificial. The bad results are multiplied if people like you don't have excellent skills to begin with. Another wake-up call is that Photoshop does not make you a great artist or designer. You only get good results if you're a skillful user, period.
It's also VERY important to know that these skills go way beyond Photoshop skills that most can learn. Especially in photo retouching, you need to have skills in numerous areas. You need to have good photography skills, a good understanding of composition, a good understanding of skin tones, facial features and expressions, lighting, colors, make-up, fashion, etc.
I can guarantee you that you currently have none of these skills. Yes, this may sound harsh and it's not my intention, but that just the reality and part of our wake-up call for you. One example: the eyes. The eyes are the MOST important part of a face, they are the doorway to our soul. You on the other hand have killed the eyes and consequently killed the soul. The eyes are always the main focal point in any portrait in which the subject is looking at the viewer. Mess up in that area and you’ve already ruined the complete image before you even start fixing other areas.
Face it: you don't know how to draw or paint a face, let alone paint a face that is beautiful. Photoshop will NOT improve those skills, period. You seriously need to know your limitations and the limitations of an image editor.
If you want to see what skills are required to do such intense photo retouching, then go to YouTube and search for videos of the user CGSBGS, with the titles…
Speed Painting Photo Realism: "In Memory of Richard..."
Speed Painting Photorealism... Again.
…or his other videos. Only those are the people cable of totally redesigning a face with a satisfying result. But their experience is based on years of practice and studies mixed with some talent.
The fact that you continue to overestimate your current skills, is also the reason why sprucemagoo1 was getting so frustrated with you, because you simply don't accept reality.
Why should others thank you for your efforts? They are not making the request here, only Bronson is.
You need to use Bob Ross as an example; he loved what he did and wanted to share with everybody how to get the same joy out of painting. Not for a single second was he teaching people to boost his own ego, not for single moment was he waiting for a round of applause.
mrlemonyfresh
Member
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uhhh-huh.
I asked for thanks because I shared my knowledge and thought hard about exactly what the guy wanted, what HE could do and what HE could learn. I only expected some gratification in the form of a thank you, not much mind you, just some kind of hint that what I said helped, otherwise what reason do I have to help? I was well aware that it was a way for me to exercise my knowledge, but I specially wrote the post for this guy.
Gratification is a common form of social currency.
Now I agree whole heartily that the guy was a bit out of line with the girl's appearance, but it looks as though you're anger has seeped into you're questionably constructive criticism.
Also, I don't NEED to do anything, please don't preach to me about ego having talked from the height of mount Everest down to this guy. Some people don't get it, but that's no reason to unleash your rage at the drop of a hat. People are given different ideals and opinions by people all around them. People they admire, people they trust, people wiser than them. I'm sure the guy has learnt a little something about social mannerism, but I doubt he would respond well to you're post. Who wants to listen to somebody who talks down to them and runs them to the ground? He won't have respect for you like that, which is why if you read a few posts back he ignored the other guy.
On a side note, I like the fact you're first post was on this thread which is funny because mine is too =]
I asked for thanks because I shared my knowledge and thought hard about exactly what the guy wanted, what HE could do and what HE could learn. I only expected some gratification in the form of a thank you, not much mind you, just some kind of hint that what I said helped, otherwise what reason do I have to help? I was well aware that it was a way for me to exercise my knowledge, but I specially wrote the post for this guy.
Gratification is a common form of social currency.
Now I agree whole heartily that the guy was a bit out of line with the girl's appearance, but it looks as though you're anger has seeped into you're questionably constructive criticism.
Also, I don't NEED to do anything, please don't preach to me about ego having talked from the height of mount Everest down to this guy. Some people don't get it, but that's no reason to unleash your rage at the drop of a hat. People are given different ideals and opinions by people all around them. People they admire, people they trust, people wiser than them. I'm sure the guy has learnt a little something about social mannerism, but I doubt he would respond well to you're post. Who wants to listen to somebody who talks down to them and runs them to the ground? He won't have respect for you like that, which is why if you read a few posts back he ignored the other guy.
On a side note, I like the fact you're first post was on this thread which is funny because mine is too =]
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